Still on the Hill

September 2007 Walnut Valley Festival

FAF:  All festivals have a particular direction or musical area of emphasis.  What does Winfield mean to you in that respect?

            Kelly:  That’s a great question.  I’m really glad you asked that because we really appreciate Winfield because it is very eclectic and they do not have lines drawn in the sand between Traditional and ‘Newfangled.’  Because we clearly belong to the ‘Newfangled Thing,’ a lot of times we feel left out, we feel shut out, we feel as if we’re threatening tradition.  In certain festivals they’re really strict about that sort of thing.  Especially, you would think, that in this, with the National Flat Picking Contest, it’s got all the Traditional elements: a real hardcore, Traditional, Preservationist element.  But here they are, hiring people like us, and we’re so appreciative of that.

            Donna:  And another thing that’s kind of interesting for us, our perspective, is that this is such a ‘hot pickers’ festival, and we think of ourselves primarily as songwriters...and we’re so honored to be here to do the NewSong Showcase.

FAF:  How did you come to be involved with the NewSong contest?  Are you judges as well, and if so, what are your criteria?

            Donna:  Well, Crow Johnson, the wonderful Crow Johnson, started it.  She was our manager.  A couple of years ago she wanted to retire.

            Kelly:  She created the Showcase herself.

            Donna:  So she put out feelers for a bunch of people who wanted to take it over...We really enjoy it.

            Kelly:  And we don’t judge.  Our job is to coordinate the judging.  We travel around the country and know a lot of folk DJs and people that have venues and certain songwriters that we trust.  We change out every year and get new judges most every year.  It’s a mind- boggling job.  We get 280 CDs and 10 categories.

            Donna:  And three judges for each category.

            Kelly:  So it’s lot of trips to the UPS Store and tracking all these things going back and forth.  And then when they come back, we do have to sort out the differences between judges.  That’s our responsibility.  And the biggest part of it is writing the comments.

            Donna:  The judges all give comments and we type them up and send them to the contestants.

            Kelly:  For all the ones that don’t win, that is the prize, getting some feedback.  So we really try hard to make sure that the judges write substantial, productive feedback..

FAF:  Do you release the names of the judges afterwards?

            Donna:  No, the judges are anonymous.

FAF:  And the songwriters receive the comments anonymously as well?

            Kelly:  They do.  The contestants really appreciate the comments.  It’s amazing how much that seems to mean to them.

FAF:  Have you tried other festivals as far as in-depth involvement such as what you have here at Winfield?

            Kelly:  This year at Kerrville we were instructors at their Music Camp for Teens.  It’s in collaboration with the Boys & Girls Club of America.  We were one of the instructors there and hung out with all the kids.  It was a great experience.  Hope to get to do that again.

FAF:  I’d like to talk about the new CD you’re working on about Ozark personalities.

            Kelly:  Passion of the moment.  We’re in the middle of a brainstorming.  We’d like to make a splash because we feel like this is important; and, we want to make sure, if we’re going to do this, we do it right.  One of our central themes of what we talk about a lot is that, in Arkansas, we have this beautiful tradition, and it’s preserved relatively well by people that are, what I call, preservationists that re-enact the music.

And that’s all good and we need people to do that, and I’m glad it’s there.  But what there isn’t much of is people that are writing new songs that reflect that tradition about characters that are maybe still alive or recently alive, and to celebrate the ongoing cultural tradition.  Because people tend to think of the Ozarks culture as a relic, something that sits on a shelf. 

And we’re trying to put the folk back into folk music.  Because there are very interesting people that are song-worthy all over the place.

            Donna:  And we’ve been researching and meeting these people for over 10 years now.  We finally have all our songs ready and we’re actually going to make a songbook that goes with it that has lyrics and photos of these people and their little anecdotes and stories.

            Kelly:  We’re going to try to collaborate with some of the historical societies in the area and try to get some backing on this.  We’re looking for some sponsorship so that we can promote it really widely throughout the state.

            Donna:  We’d like to do free concerts in all the communities these people are from, like at local libraries, where people can come and hear these stories and actually we’re looking for a benefit organization.  We envision this being a really big project, but we’re in the infant stage.

            Kelly:  Well, in the studio we’re already several songs into it, so it’s happening.  It’s happening!

FAF:  In deciding to write and record an entire CD on common folk doing their uncommon yet everyday activities, are you making a statement on your philosophy on life?

            Kelly:  Oh maybe so.  Nobody’s ever asked me that before.  I think so.  To celebrate the common man, person, is something.

            Donna:  That ordinary lives can be extraordinary. 

            Kelly:  There is a lot going on here.

            Donna:  You know, the homogenization of our country is one of the things that makes us sad.  I mean, it used to be you’d go down to the Cajun area and there was this rich culture.  There was a lot more cultural diversity, but now it’s become Generica.  Everywhere you go everything looks the same, everything is so much the same.  So we were hungry for culture.

            Kelly:  Personally, I feel very starved for that.  I feel like I don’t have an anchor.  And obviously we’re not hillbillies.  I’m a native of Fayetteville, Arkansas, but you cannot make yourself a hillbilly.  I’d been living all over the country and I felt this real strong tug, in the middle of Generica, I felt some really strong gravitational pull to go back to where I came from.  And to reclaim some sliver of culture; even if I had to fabricate it.  Honestly.  Because, what else can we do now?  I don’t like this feeling of not having a rudder, as if I was taking television as a cultural icon.  So, Still on the Hill was largely about that, when we put it together.

            Donna:  And, it’s interesting: even though I was born and raised in San Francisco, my roots are very, very country.  My Dad played country music, I grew up with old country music.  Even though I lived in cities I never felt at home there.  And when I moved to the Ozarks 20 years ago, I found my home.  I mean, I've never felt more at home and I’ve lived everywhere.  I totally belong there.  When we get back into the hills and meet these people, I totally resonate with them, with their stories ... it’s my home even though I’m a transplant!

            Kelly:  One of our stories we’ve been working on lately that’s been exciting is The Mug Tree Lady.  She’s from Batesville.  She’s well known in her area because in her front yard she’s got 500 coffee mugs nailed to a tree.  So people come to visit The Mug Tree Lady.

            Donna:  This is Clara’s therapy.  Her son was dying of AIDS.  They were very active in their small community.

            Kelly:  So we dropped by her house and she made us iced tea like she does for everybody who drops by.  We hit it off with her and she’s been writing us letters, I think we’ve gotten a dozen letters, and she even calls us.  And, it turns out that she’s probably going to be moving soon, probably into a nursing home or something.  And she wants Donna to take all her mugs.

            Donna:  I’m going to be the new Mug Tree Lady!  This whole thing has taken on a life of its own.  And we love her.

FAF:  It’s very touching.  How did you hear about the Mug Tree Lady?  And, in general, how do you come by your subjects for this project?

            Donna:  We give concerts in these areas.  And often we will ask at the concert.  We’ll say, you know, our passion is finding these ‘unsung heroes’ and interesting people who live in your area: what’s here?  And somebody will come up after the concert and say, “Let’s go down here—I want you to meet Clara.”

            Kelly:  And it’s not like we go to a library and start researching it.  Almost always it comes from somebody mentioning somebody that they think would be worthy and then we look into it.

FAF:  The ‘oral tradition’ is where we were really at with true folk music.  And we got away from that because we got into recording.  But now the recording has been subverted and we’re left with no oral tradition and few recording opportunities because the record companies don’t represent us anymore.

            Kelly:  It’s a very confusing time to be a musician.

            Donna:  And in the academic world, and a lot of the archival material, a lot of the people who are doing these kinds of historical things, they seem like they bought into a university archival sort of thing.  So we just want to do the oral tradition thing in a very grassroots way and bring it to the people.  Kind of a modern way of reclaiming that.

FAF:  Can you talk a little about some of these songs and mention what quality you admired the most in these particular people?  You want to choose maybe one or two more?

            Kelly:  We have a story about an instrument maker who’s still alive, Ed Stilley.  He’s a one-of-a-kind, an inspirational person.  He’s a very religious man and in his late life God spoke to him and told him to make musical instruments for children.  And so he set it upon himself to do this and he’s made about 180 instruments and given every one of them to children for free.

            Donna:  He lives in Hogscald Holler and the instruments are folk art – real crude.

            Kelly:  We do love this guy.  The characteristic that I admire in him is the resourcefulness of the people that settled the Ozarks.  He’s a prime example of that.  He makes these instruments from nothing, from stuff he finds in his yard.  The metal parts are door hinges, coat hangers, brazing rods, springs inside of them.  And the wood is made of stuff on his own property.  It’s all oak or walnut, basswood, whatever he happened to have.

            Donna:  And he’s a homesteader.  He plows with a mule.  He’s older now and walks with two little canes that he made himself.  And they are so full of joy and he’s so passionate about what he does.

            Kelly:  And we have two of his instruments and we’re going to record the song with his instruments.

            Donna:  Yeah, we’re the only grownups we know that have his instruments!

FAF:  Wasn’t basswood used a lot in the old days on instruments?

            Kelly:  Yes, basswood’s great wood.  And we have a big one in our back yard and we really cherish it.  They have enormous leaves, a hardy tree, real good wood.  Basswood is the ultimate carving wood for Ozark whittling.  So, we take those instruments to high schools and play for teenagers and we show them these instruments and how resourceful the person is who made them.  And I think what it does, first of all, it makes them rethink what a hillbilly is, what a hillbilly is capable of.  I mean, a person that is categorized, pigeon-holed like that, and remarkably has produced hundreds of guitars out of virtually nothing.

            Donna:  After raising eight children, and plowing with the mule in the field.

            Kelly:  And I think it makes people rethink that negative stereotype because there’s so much of the Arkansaw Traveler and somehow that tradition has become a joke.  It’s a shame because he’s not a joke.  He’s a sweet man who can be admired.

FAF:  So it sounds like you’re really involved with not only what the person produces, but also their inspiration.

            Kelly:  We tend to get kind of involved...

            Donna:  And some of them are eclectic in respect to how the song comes.  We have a brand new song about the marker trees; it’s more historical.  I found an old violin case in Glasgow recently that had a mountain dulcimer built into the case.  And I started scrubbing on it and this idea for the whole thing about the marker trees came.  Back during the Trail of Tears, the natives would often bend the white oaks to point to caves or hideouts or where they could find food.  It’s more of a historical piece.

            Kelly:  There’s still songs coming.  She’s trying to squeeze another one in; we’re going to write one together about my great great grandfather, who was a governor of Arkansas, James Barry.  And he was a one-legged Governor; lost his leg in the Civil War.  We’ve been writing that on the way here to Winfield.  He was a Confederate soldier.  And we were trying to figure out if he was song-worthy.  We’ve been digging for information and we finally were able to piece together enough information to make something worthy.  But it’s too soon to tell.  And he became a senator.  But, gotta make sure it’s right.  Too soon to tell.  We’ve got it carved out, the beginning, on the way here in the car, which is not unusual.  Yeah, we do a lot of writing in the car.

FAF:  Thanks so much.  Enjoy the Festival.